Rabbi Yehoshua is a common name; consequently, the Gemara on today’s daf TB Taanit 3 wants to clarify which Rabbi Yehoshua is talking. On yesterday’s daf one Rabbi Yehoshua is mentioned in the Mishna and the second different Rabbi Yehoshua is mentioned in a baraita. The problem that the Gemara is going to solve is neither of these rabbis could possibly be the Rabbi Yehoshua on our daf.
“It is stated in the same baraita
cited previously that Rabbi Yehuda says in the name of Rabbi Yehoshua:
With regard to the one who passes before the ark as prayer leader on
the concluding Festival day of the festival of Sukkot, the Eighth
Day of Assembly, the last prayer leader of the additional prayer mentions
rain, whereas the first prayer leader for the morning prayer does not
mention rain. Conversely, on the first Festival day of Passover, the
first prayer leader mentions rain, while the last prayer leader
does not mention rain.
“The Gemara
asks: To which statement of Rabbi Yehoshua is Rabbi Yehuda
referring? If we say that he is referring to the statement of Rabbi
Yehoshua cited in the mishna, this cannot be the case, as Rabbi
Yehoshua in our mishna said that one begins to mention
rain on the last Festival day of the festival of Sukkot, the
Eighth Day of Assembly. This indicates that one starts to mention rain
from the beginning of the day, i.e., the evening prayer service.
“Rather, you will say that Rabbi Yehuda is referring to the opinion of Rabbi
Yehoshua, cited in the baraita. However, this too is
untenable, as didn’t Rabbi Yehoshua say there that one begins to
mention rain from the time one puts down the lulav, i.e., from
the end of the seventh day of Sukkot? This statement also indicates that
one begins to mention rain from the evening service of the Eighth Day of
Assembly.
“The Gemara
asks another question: And, furthermore, that which is taught in a baraita
that Rabbi Yehuda says in the name of ben Beteira: With regard to the
one who passes before the ark on the concluding Festival day of the festival
of Sukkot, the Eighth Day of Assembly, the last prayer leader mentions
rain. To which of the halakhot of ben Beteira is Rabbi
Yehuda referring here? If we say he is referring to the ruling of Rabbi
Yehuda ben Beteira, this cannot be the case, as he said that one
begins to mention rain on the second day of Sukkot.
“Rav Naḥman Bar Yitzḥak said: Let the ben Beteira mentioned by Rabbi
Yehuda in the baraita be understood as a reference to Rabbi
Yehoshua ben Beteira, and this will resolve all the above difficulties. At
times, Rabbi Yehuda calls him by his name, Rabbi Yehoshua, despite
the fact that the name Rabbi Yehoshua generally refers to Rabbi Yehoshua ben
Ḥananya. At other times, Rabbi Yehuda calls him by his
father’s name, e.g., in the second baraita, when the ruling is
attributed to
ben Beteira. And the Gemara explains the reason for the different names:
This baraita, where he is called by his father’s name, was
written before he was ordained, and this baraita, where he is
called simply Rabbi Yehoshua, was from after he
was ordained.” (Sefaria.org translation)
We now know by process
of elimination that the Rabbi Yehoshua we were looking for is Rabbi Yehoshua
ben Beteira. We see that when a person is very young or not very important he
is generally called by his father’s name i.e. son (ben) of name ‘blank’. Other examples of tannaim in the Talmud are ben Azai and ben Zoma. When somebody
important is called by his father’s name, he is being disparaged. A good
example comes from I Samuel 20. King Saul plans to murder David when he comes
to celebrate Rosh Hodesh at his
table. Jonathan warns David of his father’s plan to kill him and tells him to
stay away. When David doesn’t show up even on the second day of Rosh Hodesh the Bible records: “But on the day
after the new moon, the second day, David’s place was vacant again. So Saul
said to his son Jonathan, “Why didn’t the son of Jesse come to the meal
yesterday or today?”” (Verse 27)
Calling somebody by his
father’s name back then is like calling somebody today by his surname. I always
hated to be called just by my surname Greene. I felt it was rude and so
impersonal. How could somebody who I like and admire treat me so disrespectfully?
I wonder whether Shimon ben Azzai and Shimon ben Zoma, who were known for their
great learning even though they never received the title Rabbi, felt the same
way.
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